本文探讨了禅那的真实性，并分析了来自不同观点的评论。一些评论者声称亲身经历过禅那，并详细描述了其体验，而另一些则质疑其真实性。作者通过引用评论者的观点，分析了禅那的本质以及其对个人意识和精神状态的影响，并探讨了禅那练习的意义和价值。

🧘‍♀️ **禅那体验：真实性与描述** 本文中，一些评论者声称亲身经历过禅那，并详细描述了其体验。他们描述了禅那带来的喜悦、平静和超然状态，以及对意识和精神状态的影响。例如，一位评论者描述了进入禅那状态的具体过程，包括对快乐的感知、对欲望的控制以及对意识状态的转变。他们还分享了禅那练习带来的益处，例如对快乐和欲望的理解、对意识状态的掌控以及对精神状态的提升。 然而，也有一些评论者质疑禅那的真实性，并认为这些描述可能夸大了其效果。他们认为禅那可能仅仅是心理上的幻觉，或者是由冥想练习带来的生理反应。他们质疑了禅那的真实性，并认为需要更严谨的科学研究来证实其存在。

🧘‍♂️ **禅那的本质：快乐、欲望与意识** 通过评论者的描述，我们可以看到禅那与快乐、欲望和意识之间的复杂关系。评论者们提到，禅那状态伴随着强烈的快乐感，但同时需要控制欲望，才能进入更深层的禅那状态。这表明禅那并非简单的追求快乐，而是需要对意识和精神状态进行深入的探索和控制。禅那的练习，本质上是通过控制欲望和情绪，来达到一种平静和超然的状态，并最终达到对意识和精神状态的掌控。 评论者们还提到，禅那的练习可以帮助人们更好地理解快乐和欲望的本质，以及它们对意识和精神状态的影响。通过禅那练习，人们可以更清晰地认识到快乐和欲望的本质，以及它们对意识和精神状态的控制。这有助于人们更好地管理情绪，控制欲望，并最终达到一种平静和超然的状态。

🧘 **禅那练习的意义与价值** 尽管对禅那的真实性存在争议，但评论者们普遍认为，禅那的练习具有重要的意义和价值。禅那练习可以帮助人们缓解压力、改善情绪、提高注意力和专注力，并促进个人成长和精神发展。通过禅那练习，人们可以更好地了解自己的内心世界，控制情绪，提高意识水平，并最终达到一种平静和超然的状态。 即使没有达到传统的禅那状态，禅那练习本身也具有积极的意义。它可以帮助人们培养正念、提高自我意识和掌控能力，并促进个人成长和精神发展。禅那练习可以被视为一种有效的精神训练方法，帮助人们更好地认识自我，控制情绪，并最终达到一种平静和超然的状态。

🧘‍♀️ **禅那的争议：真实性与个人体验** 禅那的真实性是一个复杂的问题，它涉及到意识、精神状态和个人体验等多个方面。本文中，评论者们对禅那的描述和体验各不相同，这反映了禅那的复杂性和主观性。尽管存在争议，但禅那的练习具有重要的意义和价值，它可以帮助人们更好地了解自我，控制情绪，并促进个人成长和精神发展。

🧘‍♂️ **禅那与现代社会** 在现代社会，人们面临着巨大的压力和焦虑，禅那的练习可以为人们提供一种有效的缓解压力和改善情绪的方法。禅那练习可以帮助人们培养正念，提高自我意识和掌控能力，并促进个人成长和精神发展。禅那的练习可以被视为一种有效的精神训练方法，帮助人们更好地认识自我，控制情绪，并最终达到一种平静和超然的状态。 虽然禅那的真实性仍存在争议，但其练习的意义和价值不容忽视。禅那的练习可以帮助人们更好地应对现代社会的挑战，并促进个人的身心健康和精神成长。

https://astralcodexten.substack.com/p/highlights-from-the-comments-on-jhanas

"I think it’s the first time half the commenters accused the other half of lying" I. Is Jhana Real?  

This was a fun one. I think it’s the first time half the commenters accused the other half of lying.

Okay, “half” is an exaggeration. But by my count we had 21 people who claimed to have experienced jhanas (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21), and 7 who said they were pretty sure it wasn’t real as described (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7).

The former group include people like Tetris McKenna, who wrote:

I've experienced samatha jhanas. I don't do it so much now. The first few times you get on the edge of 1st jhana, it's difficult to achieve, because you see the wave of pleasure approaching, and grasp for it, and that grasping takes you away from it. So it's a careful balancing act of pleasure/desire in the first place to get there, which you have to master to some degree. To even get to 1st jhana, you have to internally figure out some stuff about the craving/pleasure dynamic on a subconscious, mechanical level.

1st jhana is, as the author describes, intensely pleasurable. Sublime. His descriptions are spot on imo. But in some ways, it's also too much pleasure. It can feel agitating once you get used to it and aren't so awestruck by it anymore. Indeed, the latter jhanas are associated with letting go of certain aspects of the initial jhana, to more and more refined states that are more calm and equanimous than intensely pleasurable. Again, this is internalising and mastering the skill of balancing pleasure/craving.

Those calm and equanimous states of 2nd-4th jhana become much more satisfying than the initial pleasure wave of the 1st jhana. Cultivating them to that degree is a process of gaining valuable insight into the pleasure/craving dynamic in your mind. Even if you don't get to those stages, just practising 1st jhana alone will help the mind normalise the intensity of the pleasure, such that it's no big deal any more. You don't need or even want pleasure all the time, because you've seen it with such clarity, over and over again, just by setting the conditions up correctly in your mind.